Islam Threatens The Free World

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fortminor
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Post by fortminor » Sat Aug 12, 2006 9:14 am

still fightin ,Danyet? :lol:

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Post by Admiral » Sat Aug 12, 2006 10:13 am

Ohhh it's so annoying!

Who calls himself the "Boss in the world"? Who is responsible for so many colonies in Asia? What do they do in the colonies exept of stealing the treasures of others? Who is invading Iraq, who will be incvading Iran, who has the most dangerous weapons of the world, who is doing so much research to invent more destructive weapons, who is always frightened if other countries get more and more power, who is trying everything to stop them, and who is the real danger of the world?

PS: Say what you want, I don't want to fight with guys who turns his guilty conscience in blaiming others.

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Post by Admiral » Sat Aug 12, 2006 10:23 am

how old are you, danyet?

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Post by fortminor » Sat Aug 12, 2006 4:22 pm

Admiral wrote:Ohhh it's so annoying!
Who calls himself the "Boss in the world"? Who is responsible for so many colonies in Asia? What do they do in the colonies exept of stealing the treasures of others? Who is invading Iraq, who will be incvading Iran, who has the most dangerous weapons of the world, who is doing so much research to invent more destructive weapons, who is always frightened if other countries get more and more power, who is trying everything to stop them, and who is the real danger of the world?
USA = :twisted: , Israel = :evil: !

:lol:

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Post by Danyet » Sat Aug 12, 2006 5:19 pm

Admiral wrote: Who calls himself the "Boss in the world"?
Islam!





Admiral wrote: Who is responsible for so many colonies in Asia?
I don't know, who?




Admiral wrote: Who is invading Iraq,
The United Nations


Admiral wrote: who will be invading Iran,
No one needs to invade Iran. All it will take is for israel to send a few fighter/bomber aircraft over to blow the ~ out of thier nuke program. They should have already done this. Perhaps their will do it before they leave Lebanon, that would be ideal.


Admiral wrote: who has the most dangerous weapons of the world,
Quite a few countries now.

Admiral wrote: who is doing so much research to invent more destructive weapons,
IRAN! Duh!


Admiral wrote: who is always frightened if other countries get more and more power, who is trying everything to stop them,

Iran!! Duh!!



Admiral wrote: and who is the real danger of the world?
Islam. Duh!!

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Post by fortminor » Sat Aug 12, 2006 5:30 pm

danyet wrote:
Admiral wrote: who is always frightened if other countries get more and more power, who is trying everything to stop them,

Iran!! Duh!!
For example ? :roll:

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Post by Danyet » Sat Aug 12, 2006 6:13 pm

fortminor wrote:
danyet wrote:
Admiral wrote: who is always frightened if other countries get more and more power, who is trying everything to stop them,

Iran!! Duh!!
For example ? :roll:
Hmmm!......And I thought that you were only an aeroplane blonde!

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Re: Islam Threatens The Free World

Post by trangsang » Sat Aug 12, 2006 7:11 pm

danyet wrote:Just as Muslims believes that once someone becomes a Muslim that he or she can never revert back to being a non-Muslim.
A religion wouldn't force someone to stay with them but a cult would kill/threat that person.
most of the terrorists consider themselves to be devout Muslims.
It's hard to trust them and their behavior could be normal at one moment but seconds later they could kill people around them so I feel uncomfortable to be near them whether they're male or female Muslims.

It's interesting that Muslims complain when there were about 10 people killed in Lebanon but say nothing when there were 50 people killed in Iraq. By the way, those died in Iraq were killed by their fellow Muslims.

I wonder if Islam the only religion/cult that its followers behead someone. I thought this act would only happen in hell and execute by only satan.

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Post by fortminor » Sun Aug 13, 2006 10:27 am

danyet wrote:
fortminor wrote:
danyet wrote:
Iran!! Duh!!
For example ? :roll:
Hmmm!......And I thought that you were only an aeroplane blonde!
:roll:
AEROPLANE BLONDE : One who has bleached/dyed her hair but still has a 'black box'.
what do u mean :?:

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Post by Seafarer » Sun Aug 13, 2006 3:55 pm

I am muslim too..but i think that the most terrorist action that i did was to wash my brother in the toilet with cold water..
I am really disturbed by the idea of being named as a terrorist because of my religion.Indeed, it has never been thought to me to invade a country in the name of God!
But,this doesn't mean that i support terrorist actions Cause my country suffers because of it. I hate some other muslims who make people to think that every muslim is a potential terrorist. :twisted:

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Post by Danyet » Sun Aug 13, 2006 4:31 pm

Seafarer wrote:I am muslim too..but i think that the most terrorist action that i did was to wash my brother in the toilet with cold water..
I am really disturbed by the idea of being named as a terrorist because of my religion.Indeed, it has never been thought to me to invade a country in the name of God!
But,this doesn't mean that i support terrorist actions Cause my country suffers because of it. I hate some other muslims who make people to think that every muslim is a potential terrorist. :twisted:
That is like saying, " I am a member of the Nazi Party but I hate it when people accuse me of being a racist who wants to take over the world."

Admiral

Post by Admiral » Sun Aug 13, 2006 4:52 pm

the real racist here is you, danyet

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Post by Danyet » Sun Aug 13, 2006 5:53 pm

Admiral wrote:the real racist here is you, danyet
You can't prove that I am a racist any more than I can prove you are a jerk! But I can show that you are a moron because instead of countering my assertation you you resort to rediculous baseless accusations showing us all that you have he mind of a goober. (which is not a jelly bean)

Admiral

Post by Admiral » Sun Aug 13, 2006 11:15 pm

I think it's an act of stupidity to counter your brainless exclamations like "Islam!" "The United Nations!" "IRAN! Duh!" "Iran!! Duh!!" "Islam. Duh!!"

And of course I can prove that you are racist, like everybody else here in the forum. I can read English and I have also read several anti-islamic posts of you.

My advice to you is: Grow up, the sun doesn't spin around you.
Last edited by Admiral on Mon Aug 14, 2006 8:51 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Post by Seafarer » Sun Aug 13, 2006 11:30 pm

Danyet..it is a "wrong" interpretation of my words
I am not a terrorist and will never support them

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Post by Seafarer » Sun Aug 13, 2006 11:32 pm

Indeed..i wouldn't be busy with a person who call someone as "jerk".
How modern..isn't it?

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Post by Danyet » Mon Aug 14, 2006 2:35 am

Admiral wrote: I can read English and I have also written several anti-islamic posts of you.
Islam is not a race, you pillock. It is a religion basd on the cult of Mohammed.

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Post by fortminor » Mon Aug 14, 2006 8:40 am

tryin to scape ? huh ?
:lol:

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Post by Danyet » Mon Aug 14, 2006 3:24 pm

Trying to escape what?

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Post by fortminor » Mon Aug 14, 2006 3:26 pm

clear !

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Post by Danyet » Mon Aug 14, 2006 3:29 pm

Seafarer wrote:Danyet..it is a "wrong" interpretation of my words
I am not a terrorist and will never support them
I did not interpret your words.
1 It is a proven fact that Mohammed was a terrorist and murderer to his enemies

2 Islam is based on "support" for Mohammed.

3 You are Muslim

= 4 You support at least one terrorist.

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Post by fortminor » Mon Aug 14, 2006 3:32 pm

danyet wrote:
Seafarer wrote:Danyet..it is a "wrong" interpretation of my words
I am not a terrorist and will never support them
I did not interpret your words.
1 It is a proven fact that Mohammed was a terrorist and murderer to his enemies

2 Islam is based on "support" for Mohammed.

3 You are Muslim

= 4 You support terrorism.
:lol: it remind me this :
Teacher: if A=B, B=C then A=C can u tell one more example of this type
Student : I love my teacher, teacher loves his daughter, so i love my teacher's daughter...


...

it's proven just for you and your gang.Not Me or ...
prove it If you can !
:D

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Post by Danyet » Mon Aug 14, 2006 3:47 pm

fortminor wrote:
it's proven just for you and your gang.Not Me or ...
prove it If you can !
:D
It is proven by history. The fact that Mohammed murdered his detractors is admitted even by Islam.

If you want to stand by a murderer because of your emotional but irrational thinking, then no one can stop you but don't expect me or others to stand idle and let you sing this mass murderer's praises as though he were a hero.
Mohammed was the epitomy of evil. A wolf in sheeps clothing. Just look at how his religion has destroyed everything that it touches.

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Post by fortminor » Mon Aug 14, 2006 3:58 pm

danyet wrote:
fortminor wrote:
it's proven just for you and your gang.Not Me or ...
prove it If you can !
:D
It is proven by history. The fact that Mohammed murdered his detractors is admitted even by Islam.
.
really? where?

Admiral

Post by Admiral » Mon Aug 14, 2006 5:17 pm

As we talk a lot about religions, why not tell something about American religion?

President George W Bush told Palestinian ministers that God had told him to invade Afghanistan and Iraq - and create a Palestinian State.
'I'm driven with a mission from God. God would tell me, "George, go and fight those terrorists in Afghanistan." And I did, and then God would tell me, "George, go and end the tyranny in Iraq …" And I did. And now, again, I feel God's words coming to me, "Go get the Palestinians their state and get the Israelis their security, and get peace in the Middle East." And by God I'm gonna do it.'"
As Bush is a Christ, as he is the president of America vote by his folksmen, and as Bush is using Christianity to legalise his Iraq-War, we can combine Christianity with war. The men who start war because of oil are called criminals, but here we can also call them terrorist.

1 So it is a proven fact that Bush is a terrorist and murder to his enemies.

2 The majority of the American folk is based on "support" for Bush.

3 Danyet is American

= 4 Danyet supports at least one terrorist.

PS: oh yeah, I forgot the link: http://www.bbc.co.uk/pressoffice/pressr ... bush.shtml

PPS:
danyet wrote:Seafarer wrote:
Danyet..it is a "wrong" interpretation of my words
I am not a terrorist and will never support them

I did not interpret your words.
1 It is a proven fact that Mohammed was a terrorist and murderer to his enemies

2 Islam is based on "support" for Mohammed.

3 You are Muslim

= 4 You support at least one terrorist

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Post by Seafarer » Mon Aug 14, 2006 6:10 pm

Go and read something about Mohammed and Turkey. danyet.U act like a real terrorist on the forum

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Post by fortminor » Mon Aug 14, 2006 6:52 pm

Admiral wrote: 1 So it is a proven fact that Bush is a terrorist and murder to his enemies.

2 The majority of the American folk is based on "support" for Bush.

3 Danyet is American

= 4 Danyet supports at least one terrorist.

PS: oh yeah, I forgot the link: http://www.bbc.co.uk/pressoffice/pressr ... bush.shtml
:lol: speaking by his lang!
cool :wink:

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Post by Danyet » Mon Aug 14, 2006 6:59 pm

The White House has dismissed as "absurd" allegations made in a BBC TV series that President Bush claimed God told him to invade Iraq.

"He's never made such comments," White House spokesman Scott McClellan said.

And I say that you are "absurd" too!

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Post by Danyet » Mon Aug 14, 2006 7:03 pm

fortminor wrote:
danyet wrote:
fortminor wrote:
it's proven just for you and your gang.Not Me or ...
prove it If you can !
:D
It is proven by history. The fact that Mohammed murdered his detractors is admitted even by Islam.
.
really? where?
How many times do I have to post on the same issue? If you, as a Muslim, do not know what Mohammed did during his lifetime then you surely have no knowledge of Islam and can not really be a true practicing Muslim. Go do your own research on the atrocities of Mohammed. You won't believe me anyway. Then perhaps we can talk!

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Post by MissLT » Mon Aug 14, 2006 7:21 pm

Admiral wrote: 2 The majority of the American folk is based on "support" for Bush.

3 Danyet is American
It would be wise if you start to explain those sentences now.

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Post by fortminor » Mon Aug 14, 2006 7:26 pm

I've done my reasearch about Islam and I know more than ya 'bout it.

and the reason why I asked ya is I've never heard :
The fact that Mohammed murdered his detractors is admitted even by Islam.

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Post by Danyet » Mon Aug 14, 2006 7:38 pm

fortminor wrote:I've done my reasearch about Islam and I know more than ya 'bout it.

and the reason why I asked ya is I've never heard :
The fact that Mohammed murdered his detractors is admitted even by Islam.
If you knew more than me then you would at least know what i was talking about.

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Post by fortminor » Mon Aug 14, 2006 8:14 pm

Oh.I know. You're just talking about your opinions toward Islam

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Post by Danyet » Tue Aug 15, 2006 6:47 am

fortminor wrote:Oh.I know. You're just talking about your opinions toward Islam
Listen, you don't add anything much to this thread with your arguing. You have posted nothing to back your statements. Everybody (except for you) knows that Mohammed beheaded 700 to 900 Jewish captives who had surrendered to him from Medina.

Instead of your whining about opinions, why don't you prove he didn't, if you can?

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Post by fortminor » Tue Aug 15, 2006 10:50 am

danyet wrote:
fortminor wrote:Oh.I know. You're just talking about your opinions toward Islam
Listen, you don't add anything much to this thread with your arguing. You have posted nothing to back your statements. Everybody (except for you) knows that Mohammed beheaded 700 to 900 Jewish captives who had surrendered to him from Medina.

Instead of your whining about opinions, why don't you prove he didn't, if you can?
I dont wanna change your opinions by proving my statements or ... !
Quran is my document ,you dont accept it though.
I've read Quran ...and I just accept that . Not the nonsenses that Israel or USA inject to your brain!

P.S.we are not here to force each other to change opinions, but you use this forum for changing people's minds and forcing them to accept your opinions toward Islam and so many other things with your unti-islamic posts ! got it ? :roll:

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Post by zaman » Tue Aug 15, 2006 2:54 pm

zaman:
hy jhon , how are you ?
jhon: fine , thanks , what about you?
zaman: i am fine , thanks.
jhon: what is up.
zaman: nothing i was just watched TV.about the war in lebanon .
jhon: is there any surrprise news ?
zaman: yes, i heard that israel and USA are states call convocation for the peace and fight terrorism
jhon: really , you are must joke, hahhahhahhahhahahh, i can not believe that,how this things happen ? so the must for USA and israel fight themselves then.
zaman: yes you are right?

Admiral

Post by Admiral » Tue Aug 15, 2006 3:20 pm

Miss Tran wrote:Admiral wrote:

2 The majority of the American folk is based on "support" for Bush.

3 Danyet is American


It would be wise if you start to explain those sentences now.
I think I don't have to explain, Bush has won in his duel with Kerry because Bush insisted to continue his war against terrorism.

For more explanation please ask your cute boyfriend what he meant in his post at Aug 4 3:29 pm.

Admiral

Post by Admiral » Tue Aug 15, 2006 3:23 pm

I think we shouldn't shout at each other like the presidents in the elections.

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Post by Danyet » Tue Aug 15, 2006 4:57 pm

fortminor wrote: Quran is my document ,

So you you have not read Hadith or you don't believe them??


fortminor wrote: I've read Quran ...and I just accept that . Not the nonsenses that Israel or USA inject to your brain!
USA did not inject anything. USA still foolishly believes that Islam is a peaceful religion.


fortminor wrote: but you use this forum for changing people's minds and forcing them to accept your opinions toward Islam and so many other things with your unti-islamic posts
Yes, exactly!

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Post by fortminor » Tue Aug 15, 2006 9:00 pm

danyet wrote:
fortminor wrote: Quran is my document ,

So you you have not read Hadith or you don't believe them??


fortminor wrote: I've read Quran ...and I just accept that . Not the nonsenses that Israel or USA inject to your brain!
USA did not inject anything. USA still foolishly believes that Islam is a peaceful religion.


fortminor wrote: but you use this forum for changing people's minds and forcing them to accept your opinions toward Islam and so many other things with your unti-islamic posts
Yes, exactly!
Ive read also Hadith ... But Quran include everything! Its so perfect. some Hadiths are fake .(some of your colleage had make them :lol: )

dosent even matter USA injects that nonsenses or Israel ! the important point is -as you said -you seem like their slave ! :lol: so go on with your unti-islamic posts :lol: Nobody's goin to believe ya ! :lol:

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Post by Danyet » Wed Aug 16, 2006 4:44 am

Oh so some of my colleagues wrote Hadith? I wonder how they did that since Hadith was written centuries ago By Muslims!!!!

It is funny how when Muslims are presented with Hadith that contradicts the supposed "peacefulnes" of Islam they say "well that is not a real Hadith" but then they use the same Hadith for their own purpose in the Mosks!!

What do you say about Hadith written by Aisha, child bride of Mohammed, is that a fake Hadith?

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Post by Danyet » Wed Aug 16, 2006 4:51 am

Fortunately we do not need Hadith to prove that Mohammed was no prophet of God. We can use a relatively Muslim friendly site of Wikipedia to show the faults ot this tyrant.



http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Banu_Qurayza#Hadith
The killing of the Banu Qurayza men
Ibn Ishaq describes the killing of the Banu Qurayza men as follows:
Then they surrendered, and the apostle confined them in Medina in the quarter of d. al-Harith, a woman of B. al-Najjar. Then the apostle went out to the market of Medina (which is still its market today) and dug trenches in it. Then he sent for them and struck off their heads in those trenches as they were brought out to him in batches. Among them was the enemy of Allah Huyayy b. Akhtab and Ka`b b. Asad their chief. There were 600 or 700 in all, though some put the figure as high as 800 or 900. As they were being taken out in batches to the apostle they asked Ka`b what he thought would be done with them. He replied, 'Will you never understand? Don't you see that the summoner never stops and those who are taken away do not return? By Allah it is death!' This went on until the apostle made an end of them. Huyayy was brought out wearing a flowered robe in which he had made holes about the size of the finger-tips in every part so that it should not be taken from him as spoil, with his hands bound to his neck by a rope. When he saw the apostle he said, 'By God, I do not blame myself for opposing you, but he who forsakes God will be forsaken.' Then he went to the men and said, 'God's command is right. A book and a decree, and massacre have been written against the Sons of Israel.' Then he sat down and his head was struck off.
The spoils of battle, including the enslaved women and children of the tribe, were divided up among Muhammad's followers, with Muhammad himself receiving a fifth of the value (as khums, to be used for the public good). Some of these were sold soon after to raise funds for jihad.

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Post by MissLT » Wed Aug 16, 2006 5:09 am

Admiral wrote:
Miss Tran wrote:Admiral wrote:

2 The majority of the American folk is based on "support" for Bush.

3 Danyet is American


It would be wise if you start to explain those sentences now.
I think I don't have to explain, Bush has won in his duel with Kerry because Bush insisted to continue his war against terrorism.

For more explanation please ask your cute boyfriend what he meant in his post at Aug 4 3:29 pm.
Either you didn't understand his post or you denied to understand it, whatever. The bottom line is your example has nothing to do with his.

Muslims worship Mohammed with their every breath. It's against their law to question his actions or the Koran. It's not their choice to choose to worship Mohammed or not. It's a must.

Americans, on the other hand, have a choice to choose whether they should believe in or vote for baby Bush. They don't worship him. In fact, they have their rights to question his actions, beliefs, how he leads America, etc.

In Danyet's eyes Mohammed was a terrorist. And since Muslims are born to believe in Mohammed, don't have the right to question whom they worship, or can't choose to leave it, that means they indirect support the terrorist. This is what he meant.

Americans have the right to choose whom they should put in office. Not all Americans support baby Bush. However, you said Danyet is American to prove that all Americans support baby Bush. I wonder how yours and his is connected....

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Post by fortminor » Wed Aug 16, 2006 11:19 am

danyet wrote: It is funny how when Muslims are presented with Hadith that contradicts the supposed "peacefulnes" of Islam they say "well that is not a real Hadith" but then they use the same Hadith for their own purpose in the Mosks!!
Example please ???? :roll:
What do you say about Hadith written by Aisha, child bride of Mohammed, is that a fake Hadith?
I dont accept Aisha's Hadith ! Hadith is somethin written by Prophets or Imams! not each person!
there's so many historical douments for some acceptable Hadiths.

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Post by fortminor » Wed Aug 16, 2006 12:20 pm

Muslims worship Mohammed with their every breath. It's against their law to question his actions or

the Koran. It's not their choice to choose to worship Mohammed or not. It's a must.

In Danyet's eyes Mohammed was a terrorist. And since Muslims are born to believe in Mohammed,

don't have the right to question whom they worship, or can't choose to leave it, that means they

indirect support the terrorist. This is what he meant.

No Len,It's not true. i'll quote the exct verse from Koran:

2:256

There is no compulsion in religion. The right direction is henceforth distinct from error.
And he who rejecteth false deities and believeth in Allah hath grasped a firm hand hold
which will never break. Allah is Hearer, Knower.


people has the right too choose.even a person who born in muslim family can change his/her religion
when he/she grow up.

Admiral

Post by Admiral » Wed Aug 16, 2006 1:22 pm

Because fortminor said what I wanted to say I don't want to repeat the same things again.
Lennye wrote:In Danyet's eyes Mohammed was a terrorist. And since Muslims are born to believe in Mohammed, don't have the right to question whom they worship, or can't choose to leave it, that means they indirect support the terrorist. This is what he meant.
And in my eyes Bush is a terrorist. Since American people have had their "Manifest Destiny" (it's not a literally expression, see [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manifest_Destiny[/url) since their Frontier Heritage.

I have an article from my English lesson, it says:
Although American civilization took over and replaced the frontier almost a century ago, the heritage of the frontier is still very much alive in the United States today. The idea of the frontier still stirs the emotions and imaginations of the American people. Americans continue to be fascinated by the frontier because it has been a particularly important force in shaping their national values.
The frontier experience began with the first colonists settled on the wast coast of the continent in the 1600s. It ended about 1890 when the last western lands were settled.


And some information: Spanish settlers (for example Napoleon) moved to America, they invaded the (American) Indians and made their country there. And they moved farther West, fought with American Indians, and as the last western lands were settled, they said: this is America.

The text says: "The idea of the frontier still stirs the emotions and imaginations of the American people." I think it means: They still like the adventure of the Frontier Experience very much. And so I think that's the reason why Americans like to invade other countries. And that's why I said that Americans like danyet are criminals.

So either you didn't understand this background, or you didn't want to understand because this fact is not very much helpful for supporting your handsome boyfriend.
Last edited by Admiral on Wed Aug 16, 2006 4:52 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Admiral

Post by Admiral » Wed Aug 16, 2006 1:27 pm

However, I think the Real Threat of The Free World is America, because they still believe in their Frontier Heritage.
They still invade countries which are less powerful than them, and they don't want other countries to be stronger than them. Who tried to restrict the Chinese economy boom?

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Post by zaman » Wed Aug 16, 2006 1:41 pm

ok you are free in your eyes if you want to see black whight , or whight black , any how and we are free to see anything as we like , we are see that USA and isreal , bush and olmert are drovers of the terrorism in this world , and in my opinion i see all israel people animals and any one talk about my prophet by dirty speech is animal and donkey and very stupid , and i am sure about one thing allah will protect each wronged in this global.
so for that stop talking about rubish

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Post by Danyet » Wed Aug 16, 2006 3:48 pm

fortminor wrote:
danyet wrote: It is funny how when Muslims are presented with Hadith that contradicts the supposed "peacefulnes" of Islam they say "well that is not a real Hadith" but then they use the same Hadith for their own purpose in the Mosks!!
Example please ???? :roll:
What do you say about Hadith written by Aisha, child bride of Mohammed, is that a fake Hadith?
I dont accept Aisha's Hadith ! Hadith is somethin written by Prophets or Imams! not each person!
there's so many historical douments for some acceptable Hadiths.
Then tell me which books of Hadith Muslims accept.

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Post by fortminor » Wed Aug 16, 2006 5:01 pm

No ! ( There are so many lies in it )

one of the Hadith books that i accept is Nahj-al-Balagha.

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Post by Danyet » Wed Aug 16, 2006 6:28 pm

So you reject the writings of Aisha who claims to have been molested by Mohammed when she was 6 or 9 years old and embrace the writings of Imam Ali who was implicated in the murder of Uthman and was with Mohammed as he slaughtered and raped his way across Arabia. Even his own men refused to do battle for him at one pont until he went to arbitration over the accusation of the murder. Aisha herself believed he was guilty.

Perhaps when you start looking at the source of these writings in which you put your faith you will realize that the writings of such men are empty and in vain. Actions speak louder than words! Men like Ali and Mohammed are from the same mold as Saddam Hussein. One minute they are talking fatherly to children and the next, they amputating limbs and executing prisoners.

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Post by MissLT » Wed Aug 16, 2006 6:30 pm

fortminor wrote:

No Len,It's not true. i'll quote the exct verse from Koran:

2:256

There is no compulsion in religion. The right direction is henceforth distinct from error.
And he who rejecteth false deities and believeth in Allah hath grasped a firm hand hold
which will never break. Allah is Hearer, Knower.


people has the right too choose.even a person who born in muslim family can change his/her religion
when he/she grow up.
Tell me what happened to a people who decided to leave Islam? :roll:

My aunt married to a Muslim guy, so I quite know the religion myself. And I know what happened to him when he decided to leave Islam.

You can quote any verse in the Koran to prove your point; however, people in your religion practice it otherwise. Or I dare to say you only quote half of it.

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Post by MissLT » Wed Aug 16, 2006 6:34 pm

Admiral wrote:Because fortminor said what I wanted to say I don't want to repeat the same things again.
Lennye wrote:In Danyet's eyes Mohammed was a terrorist. And since Muslims are born to believe in Mohammed, don't have the right to question whom they worship, or can't choose to leave it, that means they indirect support the terrorist. This is what he meant.
And in my eyes Bush is a terrorist. Since American people have had their "Manifest Destiny" (it's not a literally expression, see [url]http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manifest_Destiny[/url) since their Frontier Heritage.

I have an article from my English lesson, it says:
Although American civilization took over and replaced the frontier almost a century ago, the heritage of the frontier is still very much alive in the United States today. The idea of the frontier still stirs the emotions and imaginations of the American people. Americans continue to be fascinated by the frontier because it has been a particularly important force in shaping their national values.
The frontier experience began with the first colonists settled on the wast coast of the continent in the 1600s. It ended about 1890 when the last western lands were settled.


And some information: Spanish settlers (for example Napoleon) moved to America, they invaded the (American) Indians and made their country there. And they moved farther West, fought with American Indians, and as the last western lands were settled, they said: this is America.

The text says: "The idea of the frontier still stirs the emotions and imaginations of the American people." I think it means: They still like the adventure of the Frontier Experience very much. And so I think that's the reason why Americans like to invade other countries. And that's why I said that Americans like danyet are criminals.

So either you didn't understand this background, or you didn't want to understand because this fact is not very much helpful for supporting your handsome boyfriend.
Again, I said either you didn't understand it or you refused to understand it. This is what I said,

Muslims worship Mohammed with their every breath. It's against their law to question his actions or the Koran. It's not their choice to choose to worship Mohammed or not. It's a must.

Americans, on the other hand, have a choice to choose whether they should believe in or vote for baby Bush. They don't worship him. In fact, they have their rights to question his actions, beliefs, how he leads America, etc.

In Danyet's eyes Mohammed was a terrorist. And since Muslims are born to believe in Mohammed, don't have the right to question whom they worship, or can't choose to leave it, that means they indirect support the terrorist. This is what he meant.

Americans have the right to choose whom they should put in office. Not all Americans support baby Bush. However, you said Danyet is American to prove that all Americans support baby Bush. I wonder how yours and his is connected....


You can tell me the whole history of the United States, but it never will be connected to his examples. Not all Americans voted for Bush. What about people who voted for Kerry? Were they supporting terrorists also? :roll:

Admiral

Post by Admiral » Wed Aug 16, 2006 7:14 pm

Ok Lennye, sorry but what you quoted from me is not what you talk about. Please read it first before quoting. Otherwise I think it's not polite.

First I bet you to read my last post because there it gives you an answer why America has a desire to conquer other countries since it's birth.

And second: If you only have the two possibilities, either Bush or his baby, the result is clear. Either Bush will tell what to do or he will tell his baby what to do.

In Danyet's eys Mohammed is a terrorist. And in my eyes Bush is a terrorist, because he uses the tradition of America for his own wishes. He uses the American's tradition: "Frontier Experience" as his advertisement for attaking Iraq and Iran.
(You can read this in the last article I quoted)

I said Danyet is American to prove that all Americans support Bush, yes. Here I used Danyet's logic. I only wanted to show you how obsessed he was. Read his post at Mon Aug 14, 2006 3:29 pm. Here danyet says that Seafarer is a terrorist because he is Muslim.
Not all Americans voted for Bush. What about people who voted for Kerry? Were they supporting terrorists also?
You should tell this sentence to your cute boyfriend. He wrote at Aug 14, 3:29 pm
Seafarer wrote:
Danyet..it is a "wrong" interpretation of my words I am not a terrorist and will never support them

I did not interpret your words. 1 It is a proven fact that Mohammed was a terrorist and murderer to his enemies 2 Islam is based on "support" for Mohammed. 3 You are Muslim = 4 You support at least one terrorist.
You know, I said I used his logic, it's not my logic. [/quote]

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Post by MissLT » Wed Aug 16, 2006 7:32 pm

And this is the reason why I said the way you used his logic to link to his is wrong since it has nothing to do with his. Muslims CANNOT choose whom they should worship. They are born with Islam. All of them worship Mohammed. Not all Americans voted for baby Bush. Tell me, what about people who didn't vote for Bush? Were they supporting terrorists?

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Post by MissLT » Wed Aug 16, 2006 7:39 pm

Admiral wrote: Ok Lennye, sorry but what you quoted from me is not what you talk about. Please read it first before quoting. Otherwise I think it's not polite.
It is exactly what I've been talking about unless you didn't understand it.
Admiral wrote:First I bet you to read my last post because there it gives you an answer why America has a desire to conquer other countries since it's birth.
China has a long history of invasion and expansion. Does it mean the same thing like you said for American history? :roll:
Admiral wrote:And second: If you only have the two possibilities, either Bush or his baby, the result is clear. Either Bush will tell what to do or he will tell his baby what to do.
No, we have the right to vote. And the majority will win. That's how democratic system is all about.
Admiral wrote:In Danyet's eys Mohammed is a terrorist. And in my eyes Bush is a terrorist, because he uses the tradition of America for his own wishes. He uses the American's tradition: "Frontier Experience" as his advertisement for attaking Iraq and Iran.
(You can read this in the last article I quoted)
And? Does it say anything about ALL Americans? Even the ones who didn't vote for him?
Admiral wrote:I said Danyet is American to prove that all Americans support Bush, yes. Here I used Danyet's logic. I only wanted to show you how obsessed he was. Read his post at Mon Aug 14, 2006 3:29 pm. Here danyet says that Seafarer is a terrorist because he is Muslim.
Muslims worship Mohammed. ALL of them. They can't choose to not to worship him. Therefore, they indirectly worship a terrorist in Danyet's eyes. You said Danyet is American to prove that ALL Americans voted for Bush and supported him. However, NOT ALL Americans voted and supported him. How is yours connected to his?

Admiral

Post by Admiral » Wed Aug 16, 2006 9:53 pm

Admiral wrote: Ok Lennye, sorry but what you quoted from me is not what you talk about. Please read it first before quoting. Otherwise I think it's not polite.
It is exactly what I've been talking about unless you didn't understand it.
Ok Lennye, to be more precise, sorry but what you quoted from me is NOT THE POINT. Please read it first before quoting. Otherwise I think it's not polite. And maybe it's better to act with facts, not with fiction. As I will show you in the following lines. Please don't quote this sentence to say that I haven't named any facts yet, they will come in the following lines.

I talked about Manifest Destiny. Did you ever mention this expression? If not then please say sorry to me that you said a wrong sentence. You exactly didn't point at this topic.

China has a long history of intern fights, between chinese parties. But China didn't go to conquer other countries far away, like what USA did for Irak. And the most dangerous fact is that USA still stays at it's Manifest Destiny.

He told the United Nations: "Either you support the American aggression or you will be meaningless".
He told: Saddam should be punished because he resisted the idea of the UN, so the United States will invade Irak, whether the UN defies or not. And the warlike content of Bush has been underlined by the Pentagon.

Bush wanted a resolution from the UN to let inspectors look whether there are weapons in Iraq. :lol: To say it other way, Bush wanted to conquer Iraq.

Bush used a lot of lies, adjustments and contradictions. He said that the Iraq is the most dangerous threat of the whole world, and that war is the only option, didn't he say? You must have watched TV.

Bush repeated: "Saddam is a second Hitler, the UN is established to prevent the "world peace" being "destroyed by the will of a small man". The Iraq was exactly such a threat, from Bush's point of view.
It's not difficult to recognize the nonsense of this speech. The Iraq had been a poor colony, destroyed in war and the ten years of sanctions. The USA makes war with Iraq frequently, whether financially, economically or military.

Bush represents the most powerful imperial country of the world, which has the most dangerous mass destruction weapons. He used this inrivaled might to destroy weaker and smaller countries. Vietnam, Libanon, Grenada, Panama, Iraq, Somalia, Sudan, Jugoslawia and Afghanistan.

USA has a lot of military bases in a lot of countries on the earth, he used them to bombard Afghanistan in the last year, thousands of civilian has been killed. and hundreds of AlQaida and Taliban has been slaughtered.

The mark of the German Nazi regime was an evil militarism and it's despise against the world law. The Bush administrators who use military as the central component of their foreign policy, is most like the Hitler government than any other government.

So who is more dangerous, the US or the Iraq, or Iran, or Libanon, or perhaps Turkey in the future? What can Muslims do with their little knifes or pistols?

What America can do with its A-bombs, we have seen.

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Post by trangsang » Wed Aug 16, 2006 10:27 pm

"Actions speak louder than words!"

"You can quote any verse in the Koran to prove your point; however, people in your religion practice it otherwise."

I agree. A photo is worth a thousand words but an action is worth a million words. Evidently, Koran doesn't mean much since they threaten to kill those who no longer believe in Islam, behead people, kill others including their fellow Muslims, and destroy their worshiped places.

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Post by Danyet » Thu Aug 17, 2006 12:14 am

I agree Transgang.


Admiral, I hope that you didn't spend a whole lot of time typing that.

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Post by Admiral » Thu Aug 17, 2006 12:32 am

:mrgreen: No I just translated it from a German site

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Post by Danyet » Thu Aug 17, 2006 1:09 am

You mean there are more people out there as looney as you?.............jeeeze!

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Post by Admiral » Thu Aug 17, 2006 8:15 am

besides, the guy is called trangsang and not Transgang, "trans" could easily let us to the brought hint of transvestism.

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Post by Danyet » Thu Aug 17, 2006 4:51 pm

Admiral wrote:besides, the guy is called trangsang and not Transgang, "trans" could easily let us to the brought hint of transvestism.
He should have picked a better name then.

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Post by fortminor » Thu Aug 17, 2006 8:56 pm

danyet wrote:Imam Ali who was implicated in the murder of Uthman and was with Mohammed as he slaughtered and raped his way across Arabia. Even his own men refused to do battle for him at one pont until he went to arbitration over the accusation of the murder. Aisha herself believed he was guilty.

Men like Ali and Mohammed are from the same mold as Saddam Hussein. One minute they are talking fatherly to children and the next, they amputating limbs and executing prisoners.
source please ! :roll:

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Post by fortminor » Thu Aug 17, 2006 8:59 pm

LennyeTran wrote:Tell me what happened to a people who decided to leave Islam? :roll:

My aunt married to a Muslim guy, so I quite know the religion myself. And I know what happened to him when he decided to leave Islam.

You can quote any verse in the Koran to prove your point; however, people in your religion practice it otherwise. Or I dare to say you only quote half of it.
If your Aunt's husband is a muslim ,I live in an Islamic country! and I have never seen anybody who is killed because of changing his/her religion.

it is a tradition between some petrified and bigoted people who name themselves as Muslims ! and as far as i know between Jews .

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Post by Danyet » Fri Aug 18, 2006 1:47 am

Listen, if you unaware of the battles that Mohammed took part in you can't know much about your own religion. Either you are playing dumb or you are dumb and either way I have no time for you because it means you don't belong in this discussion. Now don't come back until you do some homework. You obviously have not read one link I have already posted here on the various threads and neither have most of your cohorts. But at least some of them have the excuse that their english is not up to scratch. You don't!

If you bothered to explore my links a little you would have found some more links in Arabic.

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Post by Admiral » Fri Aug 18, 2006 12:42 pm

danyet wrote:Listen, if you (fortminor) unaware of the battles that Mohammed took part in you can't know much about your own religion. Either you are playing dumb or you are dumb and either way I have no time for you because it means you don't belong in this discussion. Now don't come back until you do some homework. You obviously have not read one link I have already posted here on the various threads and neither have most of your cohorts.
http://www.wahrheitssuche.org/mohammed.html

Not many guys are prepared to read your links if they read something like this
danyet wrote:So you reject the writings of Aisha who claims to have been molested by Mohammed when she was 6 or 9 years old and embrace the writings of Imam Ali who was implicated in the murder of Uthman and was with Mohammed as he slaughtered and raped his way across Arabia. Even his own men refused to do battle for him at one pont until he went to arbitration over the accusation of the murder. Aisha herself believed he was guilty.
in your posts.

After a single google search about Aisha, I found the following sentences:

Aisha is the youngest of the women of Muhammed and the only one who married as virgin... Muhammed knows Aisha from the childhood and her intelligence and joy made him smile after each meeting. She won his heart, so it's not surprising that he thought of the young Aisha when he was ready to marry again after the death of his wife Hadiga. The marriage had been taken place in the family and after it Aisha lived happily in the prophet's house... She had been deeply in love until Muhammed's death, so the women didn't hesitate in letting her to care for him in his last days. He died in Aisha's house.

This is only one of your foolish aggressions.

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Post by Danyet » Fri Aug 18, 2006 4:59 pm

Admiral wrote: Not many guys are prepared to read your links if they read something like this
danyet wrote:So you reject the writings of Aisha who claims to have been molested by Mohammed when she was 6 or 9 years old and embrace the writings of Imam Ali who was implicated in the murder of Uthman and was with Mohammed as he slaughtered and raped his way across Arabia. Even his own men refused to do battle for him at one pont until he went to arbitration over the accusation of the murder. Aisha herself believed he was guilty.
in your posts.
And why not?


Admiral wrote: After a single google search about Aisha, I found the following sentences:

Aisha is the youngest of the women of Muhammed and the only one who married as virgin... Muhammed knows Aisha from the childhood and her intelligence and joy made him smile after each meeting. She won his heart, so it's not surprising that he thought of the young Aisha when he was ready to marry again after the death of his wife Hadiga. The marriage had been taken place in the family and after it Aisha lived happily in the prophet's house... She had been deeply in love until Muhammed's death, so the women didn't hesitate in letting her to care for him in his last days. He died in Aisha's house.

This is only one of your foolish aggressions.
So what? What is that supposed to mean? No one denies that Aisha was married to Mohammed. Too bad you left out the part where Aisha was only 8 or 9 years old when he had sex with her :lol:

Perhaps you had better do more than just one google next time. True research takes time, bucko!

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Post by fortminor » Fri Aug 18, 2006 5:50 pm

danyet wrote:Listen, if you unaware of the battles that Mohammed took part in you can't know much about your own religion. Either you are playing dumb or you are dumb and either way I have no time for you because it means you don't belong in this discussion. Now don't come back until you do some homework. You obviously have not read one link I have already posted here on the various threads and neither have most of your cohorts. But at least some of them have the excuse that their english is not up to scratch. You don't!

If you bothered to explore my links a little you would have found some more links in Arabic.
I've read some of them, How i am supposed to believe 'em when most of them are Israeli sites-written by your cohorts-?
or from that nonsenses of Al-tabari and bukhari ?
:roll:

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Post by Admiral » Fri Aug 18, 2006 6:29 pm

danyet wrote:And why not?
Because your very direct way of speech, pointing the reader at the message: "Islam is bad" does not seem believable and objective, but beyond believe and subjective.
So what? What is that supposed to mean? No one denies that Aisha was married to Mohammed. Too bad you left out the part where Aisha was only 8 or 9 years old when he had sex with her

Perhaps you had better do more than just one google next
So what? This was a presentation of Mohammed's peaceful love with Aisha, not an analysis of the circumstances about the muslim marriage law. Perhaps it's normal to have a fiancee who is 9 at that time.

Too bad that I'm only saying what is right and I'm not dealing with your argumentation-counterargumentation tactic.

http://www.kleio.org/mittelalter/MaV1a.htm

This is a site about the circumstances in the middle ages. Here they say that the age doesn't matter. For example Mathilde († 1189), a sister of Richard Löwenherz, has become engaged 1165 in the age of 9 yeaars with the 26 years old Heinrich the Lion. After 3 years they married.

The middle ages is 500-1500 after Christ, the Koran has been written about 600 A.C.

You can't use the laws of today to judge about a civilisation thousands of years before. In that time your ancestors lived such a life, too.

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Post by fortminor » Fri Aug 18, 2006 6:37 pm

Perhaps it's normal to have a fiancee who is 9 at that time.
exactly !

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Post by Danyet » Sat Aug 19, 2006 7:50 am

fortminor wrote:
Perhaps it's normal to have a fiancee who is 9 at that time.
exactly !
You two have serious moral problems if you actually believe that!!

Does the keeping of immoral customs because "everybody else is doing it" makt it acceptable?

By your logic it was OK for native Africans to practice canibalism because it was accepted at the time.

God would not condone canibalism and have a canibal for his prophet. Just as He would not choose and condone a guy that likes to have sex little girls to be His prophet. Mohammed was not God's prophet!

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Post by Danyet » Sat Aug 19, 2006 7:58 am

Admiral wrote:
You can't use the laws of today to judge about a civilisation thousands of years before.
I am not judging a civilization. I am judging one man...Mohammed. He was no better than any one else in fact he was worse!

If he was truely a man of God he would have behaved like one and not the raping, mudering coward he was.

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Post by Danyet » Sat Aug 19, 2006 8:04 am

fortminor wrote:
I've read some of them, How i am supposed to believe 'em when most of them are Israeli sites-written by your cohorts-?
Then you can't believe Islamic sites either because they are written by your cohorts and therefore biased.

So why don't you start by going to relatively neutral http://www.wikipedia.com

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Post by Danyet » Sat Aug 19, 2006 9:10 am

fortminor wrote: or from that nonsenses of Al-tabari and bukhari ?
:roll:
That’s funny, most Muslims seem to think that Al-tabari and bukhari are authentic and quote from them on their Muslim web sites. But perhaps you are neither a real blonde or a real Muslim and don’t know it!! Tsk Tsk!!
CLICK


CLICK


CLICK

Admiral

Post by Admiral » Sat Aug 19, 2006 1:04 pm

I am not judging a civilization. I am judging one man...Mohammed. He was no better than any one else in fact he was worse!
If you only judge Muhammed that's ok. Saidly I didn't have this impression while reading your following post:
If he was truely a man of God he would have behaved like one and not the raping, mudering coward he was.

I did not interpret your words.
1 It is a proven fact that Mohammed was a terrorist and murderer to his enemies

2 Islam is based on "support" for Mohammed.

3 You are Muslim

= 4 You support at least one terrorist.
From my objective point od view, I can't perceive the meassgae: "I am judging one man...Mohammed.", but I can perceive your judge: "Islam is a terrorist nation."
Like you said, 1. Muhammed is a terrorist, 2. Islam supports Muhammed, 3. Muslim are all terrorists.
So, if you count 1 and to together you will get 3, from your point of view.

It would be good if you think first before writing an agrressive message. All these could be used against you. It's better for you to accept the truth and say sorry to the guys you insulted.

Admiral

Post by Admiral » Sat Aug 19, 2006 4:35 pm

This posting of me is only concerning the 1st "CLICK!" of danyet, because I haven't read the others yet.
Some Muslims use the weak Hadith defense, because they approach Muhammad with their own wishful presuppositions. So, they automatically reject any Hadith that does not meet the standard of their uncritical assumptions. Our beliefs should be grounded in historical reality: not wishful thinking.
The whole text deals with this criticism. The reasons why it's only a wishful personal thinking is because muslims should have chosen which Hadits to believe in and which not. Then the text critisizes that these wishful thinkings should not be belived in.

And the text deals with the ridiculous quarrel about which of the books are true: Bible or Koran, "as a side note".
As a side note, some Muslim scholarship applies their third standard to the events of the Bible. For example, some believe that all prophets lived sinless lives. Since Muslim belief teaches that adultery is a sin, it would follow that no prophet committed adultery. Therefore, since we believe that King Dawud (King David) was a prophet, it follows that he never committed adultery with Bathsheba (2 Samuel 11:2-5). Therefore, we must conclude that the biblical report of King Dawud's adultery was not a true report because the historicity of the report is irrelevant.
After we connected those things together, if this quote should be proving: The USA makes and will be making war with all believers of Koran because Koran isn't a documentary film which shows us that everything it says is true, I would die of laughter.

More amusing, if I haven't died yet because of laughter, the author of the article makes a comparison between Bible and Koran and says that Bible is more believable for the Americans, so the Koran is wrong. And that's maybe also a reason why the USA should make war with the islamic people.

:mrgreen: this should land in the "jokes" thread.

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Post by Danyet » Sat Aug 19, 2006 5:09 pm

You have obviously not truely read or put much thought into, the Prophet of Doom site! (from which you have quoted) :roll:

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Post by fortminor » Sat Aug 19, 2006 5:14 pm

danyet wrote:
fortminor wrote: or from that nonsenses of Al-tabari and bukhari ?
:roll:
That’s funny, most Muslims seem to think that Al-tabari and bukhari are authentic and quote from them on their Muslim web sites. But perhaps you are neither a real blonde or a real Muslim and don’t know it!! Tsk Tsk!!
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Muhammad has not raped anyone! these are just nonsenses spread by enemies of Islam. its exactly agains his religion to rape women .Its just creature of your petrified mind and your cohorts!

still there are some acceptable Hadith in Al-tabari and Bukhari . but not all of 'em!
also I have to say wikipedia is not neutral !Islam has so many branches , I just accept shia.
so go and search on shia sites!

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Post by Danyet » Sat Aug 19, 2006 5:33 pm

fortminor wrote:
still there are some acceptable Hadith in Al-tabari and Bukhari . but not all of 'em!
also I have to say wikipedia is not neutral !Islam has so many branches , I just accept shia.
so go and search on shia sites!
This is exactly what I was talking about. Muslims believe only what they feel like at any given time.
You will never find the truth if you only get your history from Shia. :roll:
The historical facts are that Momammed allowed his men to rape their captives and he himself took captive women as sex slaves. ( what is so hard to believe about that?

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Post by MissLT » Sat Aug 19, 2006 8:10 pm

Admiral wrote:
Ok Lennye, to be more precise, sorry but what you quoted from me is NOT THE POINT. Please read it first before quoting. Otherwise I think it's not polite. And maybe it's better to act with facts, not with fiction. As I will show you in the following lines. Please don't quote this sentence to say that I haven't named any facts yet, they will come in the following lines.
Didn't you see it's been pointless for you to quote the whole history of the United States when you haven't been able to answer my simple question, which I've asked you several times.

Not all Americans voted and supported Bush. Tell me, what about those who didn't vote and support him? Were they supporting Bush, a terrorist, in your eyes?
Admiral wrote:I talked about Manifest Destiny. Did you ever mention this expression? If not then please say sorry to me that you said a wrong sentence. You exactly didn't point at this topic.
So? What is the relation, I may ask?
Admiral wrote:Bush wanted a resolution from the UN to let inspectors look whether there are weapons in Iraq. :lol: To say it other way, Bush wanted to conquer Iraq.

Bush used a lot of lies, adjustments and contradictions. He said that the Iraq is the most dangerous threat of the whole world, and that war is the only option, didn't he say? You must have watched TV.

Bush repeated: "Saddam is a second Hitler, the UN is established to prevent the "world peace" being "destroyed by the will of a small man". The Iraq was exactly such a threat, from Bush's point of view.
It's not difficult to recognize the nonsense of this speech. The Iraq had been a poor colony, destroyed in war and the ten years of sanctions. The USA makes war with Iraq frequently, whether financially, economically or military.

Bush represents the most powerful imperial country of the world, which has the most dangerous mass destruction weapons. He used this inrivaled might to destroy weaker and smaller countries. Vietnam, Libanon, Grenada, Panama, Iraq, Somalia, Sudan, Jugoslawia and Afghanistan.

USA has a lot of military bases in a lot of countries on the earth, he used them to bombard Afghanistan in the last year, thousands of civilian has been killed. and hundreds of AlQaida and Taliban has been slaughtered.

The mark of the German Nazi regime was an evil militarism and it's despise against the world law. The Bush administrators who use military as the central component of their foreign policy, is most like the Hitler government than any other government.

So who is more dangerous, the US or the Iraq, or Iran, or Libanon, or perhaps Turkey in the future? What can Muslims do with their little knifes or pistols?

What America can do with its A-bombs, we have seen.
And? Why don't you just simply answer this question of mine and we shall go on further,

Not all Americans voted and supported Bush. Tell me, what about those who didn't vote and support him? Were they supporting Bush, a terrorist, in your eyes?

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Post by MissLT » Sat Aug 19, 2006 8:19 pm

fortminor wrote:
If your Aunt's husband is a muslim ,I live in an Islamic country! and I have never seen anybody who is killed because of changing his/her religion.

it is a tradition between some petrified and bigoted people who name themselves as Muslims ! and as far as i know between Jews .
My uncle didn't get killed when he left Islam. If he had been killed, he wouldn't have married my aunt. Instead, he was abandoned and shunned. I criticize any religion that tries to shun others because they don't share the same faith anymore. It's wrong! Religions were built to teach others to love, not to form a gang and shun someone out of the group. Acting otherwise than bringing love and peace is a cult-like group, to me.

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Post by MissLT » Sat Aug 19, 2006 8:30 pm

Admiral wrote:
If he was truely a man of God he would have behaved like one and not the raping, mudering coward he was.

I did not interpret your words.
1 It is a proven fact that Mohammed was a terrorist and murderer to his enemies

2 Islam is based on "support" for Mohammed.

3 You are Muslim

= 4 You support at least one terrorist.
From my objective point od view, I can't perceive the meassgae: "I am judging one man...Mohammed.", but I can perceive your judge: "Islam is a terrorist nation."
Like you said, 1. Muhammed is a terrorist, 2. Islam supports Muhammed, 3. Muslim are all terrorists.
So, if you count 1 and to together you will get 3, from your point of view.

It would be good if you think first before writing an agrressive message. All these could be used against you. It's better for you to accept the truth and say sorry to the guys you insulted.
You quoted him and you still can't see it. How sad. Let me rephrase it for you to enlighten you, okay.

His point 1. That guy is a terrorist to him.
His point 2. Muslims must worship him and praise him, no matter what he'd done.
His point 3. The poster was a Muslim who denied what M. did. Or in other words, if you were a Gernman who didn't question anything about Hitler's action, but you said you didn't like the thought of killing a Jew. It'd would be s hypocritical saying since you'd already indirectly supported him by not questioning his ways.
His point 4. Since the poster didn't try to question what he'd done, he indirectly supported a terrorist in Danyet's eyes.

So, anymore quotes about American's history for me to prove your points.

Admiral

Post by Admiral » Sat Aug 19, 2006 8:38 pm

Admiral wrote:
I talked about Manifest Destiny. Did you ever mention this expression? If not then please say sorry to me that you said a wrong sentence. You exactly didn't point at this topic.

So? What is the relation, I may ask?


The relation is: American's thought has been based on the Manifest Destiny since the foundation of America. (I learned this at school)
And the Manifest Destiny is the belief to conquer other people, to give them the American way of life, which they thought is the best way of life for the mankind.
The Manifest Destiny rose up when strong believing catholic spanish settlers moved from the east coast of the American continent to the west. When they placed their frontier more and more westwards, they had to start again and again turning a wilderness into a civilised village, combating native people, survive with the goods nature gave them etc.

My teacher told me that the country America rose from this "Moving west", at the beginning where the first settlers came there to the end where they have settled the whole continent. So the thought of adventure, inventiveness, braveness (and the mood of invading other countries, but this is only what I think) became a national value/mark of Americans.
And now the Manifest Destiny still plays an important role in the political decisions of the United States. That's what I learned at the English lessons at school when I had been in the high school.

The wars of America (Vietnam, Iraq, Afghanistan...) must have something to do with this national value of them.

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Post by MissLT » Sat Aug 19, 2006 8:39 pm

And? How many Americans do you know think that way?

Admiral

Post by Admiral » Sat Aug 19, 2006 8:43 pm

My teacher told me that all Americans think in this way more or less. I can't give my own thoughts because I haven't been in America, but I hope (and I'm sure) there are also Americans who are sensible and know how to deal with such problems.

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Post by MissLT » Sat Aug 19, 2006 8:46 pm

Admiral wrote:My teacher told me that all Americans think in this way more or less. I can't give my own thoughts because I haven't been in America, but I hope (and I'm sure) there are also Americans who are sensible and know how to deal with such problems.
This is the reason why I've been debating with you. You have been using your sense of ALL to judge Americans based on American history. Now, please just answer the simple question that I've asked you several times. It might be the fourth or the fifth time I've asked; I've lost count.

Not all Americans voted and supported Bush. Tell me, what about those who didn't vote and support him? Were they supporting Bush, a terrorist, in your eyes?

Admiral

Post by Admiral » Sat Aug 19, 2006 9:02 pm

His point 1. That guy is a terrorist to him.
His point 2. Muslims must worship him and praise him, no matter what he'd done.
His point 3. The poster was a Muslim who denied what M. did. Or in other words, if you were a Gernman who didn't question anything about Hitler's action, but you said you didn't like the thought of killing a Jew. It'd would be s hypocritical saying since you'd already indirectly supported him by not questioning his ways.
His point 4. Since the poster didn't try to question what he'd done, he indirectly supported a terrorist in Danyet's eyes.
Thank you for giving me his point of view, Lennye. Yeah, if danyet really meant this, I wouldn't have posted my critisicm.

What I think to these opinions, is that Americans should have let the culture develope itself, because a strong bind to religion is what all countries had in their primal state.

I can understand that Americans were very angry because of 11.9., and so the Irak War was (although it's wrong) imaginable.
But however I guess the Americans now want to shut out the danger that there could be a terror act again, so they wanted to shut out any reason of terrorism.
But I still think it's wrong to shut out the religion, because a religion is only a sort of paper to me. And I think America should rather attack the terrorist organisation than to attack the countries where the terrorists are staying, because the countries didn't have anything to do with the terrorists.

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Post by MissLT » Sat Aug 19, 2006 9:06 pm

Please answer my question that I've asked you first. This is all I'm asking. It's a simple question, and I don't understand why you haven't been able to answer it. :?

Admiral

Post by Admiral » Sat Aug 19, 2006 9:07 pm

Not all Americans voted and supported Bush. Tell me, what about those who didn't vote and support him? Were they supporting Bush, a terrorist, in your eyes?
For a president voting, it's only important what the majority said. Is it right? So, I meaned "Americans" by "the majority of Americans", I thought it could be counted as the same, at least for talking about voting.
I should have said: "the majority of Americans", sorry.

Admiral

Post by Admiral » Sat Aug 19, 2006 9:08 pm

Please answer my question that I've asked you first. This is all I'm asking. It's a simple question, and I don't understand why you haven't been able to answer it.
I was answering your last posting when you posted a new one.

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Post by MissLT » Sat Aug 19, 2006 9:13 pm

Exactly! I never said his examples were right, but I could see where he was coming from. As for yours, I couldn't see the relations. That's why I've been asking you. As you know American population is approximately around 250 millions, and 48% of them voted for Kerry in the 2004 presidential voting. Do you know how many Americans you've said supported for a terrorist while they didn't? :roll:

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Post by Danyet » Sun Aug 20, 2006 1:26 am

And remember, less than half of eligible voters in USA did not even vote at all. So only 25% of eligible voters even voted for Bush

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Post by eman » Sun Aug 20, 2006 5:12 am

say whatever you want.......danyet

I really believe in my religion....

and every individual has his own personality.....even you danyet
and my prophet mohammed had sent to this world to guide people to islam...because allah asked him to do that


USA is responsible for all the wars around the world not islam...because USA trying to judging islam and finish it.....this is the main reason

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Post by fortminor » Sun Aug 20, 2006 9:44 pm

LennyeTran wrote: Religions were built to teach others to love, not to form a gang and shun someone out of the group.
i strongly accept this part, and Islam is a religion of peace and Love in my opinion.I dont wanna change yours! :wink:

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Post by Danyet » Mon Aug 21, 2006 12:55 am

fortminor wrote: and Islam is a religion of peace :wink:
If Islam is a religion of piece....tell how come Mohammed waged so many wars?

Did Buddha wage wars?
Did Jesus wage wars?

NO! Mohammed waged war! May he rot in hell for his crimes and his lies.

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Post by MissLT » Mon Aug 21, 2006 5:17 am

fortminor wrote:
LennyeTran wrote: Religions were built to teach others to love, not to form a gang and shun someone out of the group.
i strongly accept this part, and Islam is a religion of peace and Love in my opinion.I dont wanna change yours! :wink:
Did you really read what you quoted? Your religion abandons and shuns people who leave Islam. You can figure out the rest of what I'm trying to say, can't you?

Admiral

Post by Admiral » Mon Aug 21, 2006 7:10 am

fortminor wrote:
LennyeTran wrote:

Religions were built to teach others to love, not to form a gang and shun someone out of the group.


i strongly accept this part, and Islam is a religion of peace and Love in my opinion.I dont wanna change yours!

Did you really read what you quoted? Your religion abandons and shuns people who leave Islam. You can figure out the rest of what I'm trying to say, can't you?
She thought you were speaking in a friendly way without bad background intentions. How can you require others to don't think Islam is evil to think in your way?

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Post by MissLT » Mon Aug 21, 2006 7:26 am

Admiral wrote:
fortminor wrote:
LennyeTran wrote:

Religions were built to teach others to love, not to form a gang and shun someone out of the group.


i strongly accept this part, and Islam is a religion of peace and Love in my opinion.I dont wanna change yours!

Did you really read what you quoted? Your religion abandons and shuns people who leave Islam. You can figure out the rest of what I'm trying to say, can't you?
She thought you were speaking in a friendly way without bad background intentions. How can you require others to don't think Islam is evil to think in your way?
She only wanted to believe what she wanted to believe, which was not what I was originally talking about. As I said,

I criticize any religion that tries to shun others because they don't share the same faith anymore. It's wrong! Religions were built to teach others to love, not to form a gang and shun someone out of the group. Acting otherwise than bringing love and peace is a cult-like group, to me.

Her religion abandons and shuns people who don't share the same faith anymore. She left out that part because she didn't wanna accept it and went on to praise it instead. She can do that to whoever she likes, but not in front of me when I just fnished criticizing it. It's a slap in my face, to me.

Admiral

Post by Admiral » Mon Aug 21, 2006 7:40 am

danyet wrote:Did Jesus wage wars?
Jesus wrote:Don't think I have come to bring peace to the earth. I have not come to bring peace to the earth, but the sword! Quoted from Matthäus, 10th chapter, verse 34, and Jesus said it.
So Jesus wanted, but only didn't achieve. http://bitflow.dyndns.org/german/Andrea ... 030216.doc

And what do you say about the crusades against the Orthodox and the Islam? Wikipedia says that the motives are religious and economical.
http://de.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kreuzzug

danyet wrote:Did Buddha wage wars?
Buddha himself didn't, but for example Japan made war towards USA in the 2nd world war because they said it's a defense for the buddhist nations.

Sometimes Buddhist temples in Japan or Tibet made wars against others, sometimes Buddhist countries made wars against others (for example Thailand and Burma).


I really wonder whether the mankind can live without war.

edit: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: Ok it was my fault I quoted danyet's post but I thought he was Lennye, sorry very much to you both. I have already corrected it.
Last edited by Admiral on Mon Aug 21, 2006 8:19 am, edited 2 times in total.

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