future of EU

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LadyMacbeth
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future of EU

Postby LadyMacbeth » Sun Oct 08, 2006 6:23 am


Admiral

Postby Admiral » Sun Oct 08, 2006 9:08 am

I find it gosh Germans don't want turkeys to be in Germany because they have racist feelings towards turkeys. What Merkel said etc. only mirrors this great racist feeling.
Geografically and similarity spoken, I don't think turkey should go to EU, not because I am racist feeling, only because (if you look on the map) turkey rather belongs to Asia than to Europe.
If Russia is not Europe then Turkey shouldn't be Europe, neither.

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istattack
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Postby istattack » Wed Oct 18, 2006 11:53 am

you are wrong.Turkey have to be in EU.becaese EU needs Turkey but doesn't need Russia.everybody knows that germany has racist feelings.remember *Ottoman*do u know about that??Ottoman was the most compassionate empire in the world...but now look at these countries..ı hope you will understand me ok.see you again...

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feanor
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Postby feanor » Wed Oct 18, 2006 12:26 pm

techincally, eu is already getting what he needs from turkey. turkey is the only country who signed for customs union in the mid 1990s and opened its customs for eu products without being an eu member. i guess no need to say that this caused our economy collapsed.

it is an obvious fact that eu will not accept turkey's membership (because of being asian, muslim, population...). but also it is a more obvious fact that eu needs turkey by his side. today it seems that negotiations keep going for turkey's membership but indeed this is just a political game for interfering turkey's interior and national policy and making turkey stand by his side. you cant even imagine what compensations they demand us in the name of negotiations for eu.

Admiral

Postby Admiral » Wed Oct 18, 2006 6:14 pm

but Germans really don't like Turkish people. My friends all say: "Stay out of their way, they are bad people." I don't agree but they really say.

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feanor
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Postby feanor » Wed Oct 18, 2006 6:54 pm

and here we dont have an issue of how to make germans love us.. all nations have some prejudices against some other nations caused by various reasons.

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MissLT
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Postby MissLT » Wed Oct 18, 2006 7:16 pm

istattack wrote:you are wrong.Turkey have to be in EU.becaese EU needs Turkey but doesn't need Russia.everybody knows that germany has racist feelings.remember *Ottoman*do u know about that??Ottoman was the most compassionate empire in the world...but now look at these countries..ı hope you will understand me ok.see you again...

the most compassionate empire in conquer to expand their land with swords or making peace? :?

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feanor
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Postby feanor » Thu Oct 19, 2006 12:28 pm

can u give me an example from history about an empire that is unwilling to expand its lands? and if ottoman was not compassionate, now more than half of the world would be muslim and speaking ottoman language.

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istattack
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Postby istattack » Fri Oct 20, 2006 7:22 am

fenor,ı share in your idea.but it is not important to be the lord of the world for Ottoman.they just wanted to spread their religion over the world but,they did not do that with sword like Roma Empire.because they knew that thw sword could not address to people's heart.god bless you byees.

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MissLT
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Postby MissLT » Fri Oct 20, 2006 4:23 pm

feanor wrote:can u give me an example from history about an empire that is unwilling to expand its lands? and if ottoman was not compassionate, now more than half of the world would be muslim and speaking ottoman language.

You are twisting history right now. They LOST the fight and were forced to shrink their territory.

Admiral

Postby Admiral » Fri Oct 20, 2006 4:27 pm

racism is not good, really

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feanor
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Postby feanor » Fri Oct 20, 2006 8:48 pm

LennyeTran wrote:You are twisting history right now. They LOST the fight and were forced to shrink their territory.

what r u talking about? of course they lost, this is why we call it history. every empire had lost and everyone will lost one day.
but it seemed to me that u have no idea about how the ottoman system worked in the lands they conquered. i meant this.

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MissLT
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Postby MissLT » Fri Oct 20, 2006 9:32 pm

One example,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armenian_Genocide

Until the late 19th century, the Armenians were referred to as millet-i sadika (loyal nation) by the Ottomans.[citation needed] However, unlike Muslim citizens, Armenians, Greeks, other Christians, Jews, and other minorities, were subject to laws which gave them fewer legal rights and they were subject to numerous limitations in legal rights in the empire: Armenians were barred from serving in the military (in its stead, forced to pay an exemption tax), their testimony in Islamic courts was inadmissible against Muslims, were not allowed to bear arms, were heavily taxed and treated overall as second-class citizens.[2] As the largest minority present in the Ottoman Empire, Armenians were in effect, infidels in the eyes of Muslims, as described by British ethnographer William Ramsay: (copied)

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MissLT
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Postby MissLT » Fri Oct 20, 2006 9:35 pm

Anyway, I think this could be considered as history or politics talk, so there's no need to go on since the new rule has been established.

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feanor
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Postby feanor » Sat Oct 21, 2006 8:25 am

LennyeTran wrote:One example,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armenian_Genocide

Until the late 19th century, the Armenians were referred to as millet-i sadika (loyal nation) by the Ottomans.[citation needed] However, unlike Muslim citizens, Armenians, Greeks, other Christians, Jews, and other minorities, were subject to laws which gave them fewer legal rights and they were subject to numerous limitations in legal rights in the empire: Armenians were barred from serving in the military (in its stead, forced to pay an exemption tax), their testimony in Islamic courts was inadmissible against Muslims, were not allowed to bear arms, were heavily taxed and treated overall as second-class citizens.[2] As the largest minority present in the Ottoman Empire, Armenians were in effect, infidels in the eyes of Muslims, as described by British ethnographer William Ramsay: (copied)

ok, i see, and when our topic is this so-called genocide, it will be an extremely political talk.
i dont mean to contradict your rules but just to notify you and anybody who reads these

http://www.anarmenianmyth.com/
http://www.tallarmeniantale.com/
http://www.armenianreality.com/armenian ... carthy.htm

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MissLT
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Postby MissLT » Sat Oct 21, 2006 5:55 pm

There's a topic about this whole thing at this site. You can read it to see how people responded and remain on your side if you wanted to.

http://www.englishforums.com/English/Ar ... r/Post.htm

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Postby wllsp » Sat Oct 21, 2006 6:02 pm

Admiral wrote:I find it gosh Germans don't want turkeys to be in Germany because they have racist feelings towards turkeys. What Merkel said etc. only mirrors this great racist feeling.

I disagree. To me it means that Turkey is just not suitable right now for joining the EU. There are lots of unresolved problems surrounding this issue and it would be incorrect to narrow down all of them simply to racism.

Admiral wrote:Geografically and similarity spoken, I don't think turkey should go to EU, not because I am racist feeling, only because (if you look on the map) turkey rather belongs to Asia than to Europe.
If Russia is not Europe then Turkey shouldn't be Europe, neither.

Interestingly, Cyprus is in Asia, but it is a EU member. If Turkey were a prosperous stable state like Cyprus most european leaders would ignore the fact that it is rather an asian country.

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istattack
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Postby istattack » Sat Oct 21, 2006 6:47 pm

Feanor, I think EU is trying to prove that EU is christian union.bye the way France put the Armenian Genocide(so-called) to a veto,and ıt was accepted in their parliament.this is the first step to actualize their egregious aspiration.Armenians says 'we are associate'but France is still trying the world to accept a frivolity: Armenian Genocide(so-called)(!).
A French historian became Turkish citizen.Did you ask yourself why???because;he coluld not stand these fable anymore.and these pictures which is about killed Armenians(!)were taken by Armenians.they are not Armenians.they are Turks!!!please don not believe everything.This is accepted by all the historians.see you byees

Admiral

Postby Admiral » Sat Oct 21, 2006 7:14 pm

wllsp wrote:I disagree. To me it means that Turkey is just not suitable right now for joining the EU. There are lots of unresolved problems surrounding this issue and it would be incorrect to narrow down all of them simply to racism.


Turkey has tried many years to get into EU. Ok, the thing with Cyprus is hard but if Turkey allows Cprus ships into its harbours I don't see other disadvantages.

I also guess like istattack thatEU wants itself to be a Christian country instead of a multireligious country. For example in Germany they forbid muslim teachers to wear headscarf, I don't see the reason.

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feanor
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Postby feanor » Sat Oct 21, 2006 7:58 pm

istattack wrote:
A French historian became Turkish citizen.Did you ask yourself why???because;he coluld not stand these fable anymore.and these pictures which is about killed Armenians(!)were taken by Armenians.they are not Armenians.they are Turks!!!please don not believe everything.This is accepted by all the historians.see you byees


you misunderstood it. they are all turkish people and it is writthen under each picture who they are
Last edited by feanor on Sat Oct 21, 2006 8:10 pm, edited 2 times in total.

LadyMacbeth
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Turkey in EU

Postby LadyMacbeth » Sat Oct 21, 2006 8:01 pm

Well... will it change anything at all?
I usually read a lot of things (on the Net too). And my immpression is that noone in Europe cares about EU at all (EU representatives including).
What I can also notice is that less important organisations are copying things from the bigger ones. Thus EU seems to me got drowned into the flood of bigger international networks. Some days ago I saw a big poster of some international organisations that are carrying help to impoverished people. EU was one of them.
:oops: :oops: :oops:
Do you have similar observations?
:roll: :roll: :roll:

Cheers,
LM.


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