A raped woman was sentenced to jail!

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MissLT
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Postby MissLT » Sun Dec 02, 2007 8:46 am

Tora wrote: This is a very wide-spread idea that it's a raped woman's fault that such a calamity has happend to her - her dress, behavior and so on, seems like the way a moman behaves waives several rules of men's behavior :roll:

In my country if a woman is walking from a concert alone at the 11 pm in a night dress it is obvious she's looking for troubles... and if something happens it would be considered as "Her fault". So stupid actually

Isn't that sad? When a girl who wore a mini-skirt got raped, some people would start staying, "serve her right for wearing a mini-skirt. She was basically asking for trouble." :roll: What the heck...

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Postby MissLT » Sun Dec 02, 2007 8:55 am

=Ahmad= wrote:
sunshine81 wrote:
It’s all for their own good. It has nothing to do with limiting their freedom.


It is limiting their freedom! That's for sure!



First, Islam clearly states that men and women are equal. Islam never considers women the second class in society.

You're contradicting yourself. If you have certain rules set for women allowing them to do just certain things, this is not equal. Why aren't women allowed to choose whether they wanted to be on the street by themselves or not?

=Ahmad= wrote:Second, Islam never limits the movements of women. They can be anything they want. They have equal rights in education. They can be doctors, engineers, teachers, lawyers, scientists, writers, politicians, etc.

Can you please take the word Islam out? Some of you guys don't wanna associate Islam and human rights since you guys say they don't have anything to do with Islam. Now you wanted to link them together? And when we talk about Islam, you guys will start saying oh remember the rule, no politics and religion.
Last edited by MissLT on Sun Dec 02, 2007 9:08 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Postby MissLT » Sun Dec 02, 2007 8:59 am

=Ahmad= wrote:Fourthly, let’s discuss your case.
As I said before, it’s just fine for women to be a taxi driver. They can open the taxi glass windows so that people can see her, pass public areas where there are a lot of people there, or being accompanied by her relatives such as her kid, or select the passengers to take. My suggestion is if that’s the only job available and suitable with her expertise, then just take it. But if there are some other jobs out there, why not try to apply for them.

Thank you very much.

Excuse me, how can they be a taxi driver when they are not even allowed to drive in some Muslim countries? Who are you fooling here with this kinda explanation? :roll:

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Postby MissLT » Sun Dec 02, 2007 9:07 am

Moody wrote:THE REALITY FACT IS SECULAR WESTERNS ARE AFRAID OF SUPERIOR ISLAMIC LAWS AND SOCIAL SYSTEM COMPARE TO THEIR LAWS WHICH HAS ALREADY LOST THE MORAL AND PRINCIPLE GROUNDS AND A HOUCH POUCH OF CONFUSION AND DOUBLE STANDARDS!

Okay enough said here. I don't think we need to argue more. Let the words speak for themselves and for people to judge. :roll:

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Postby Moody » Sun Dec 02, 2007 11:55 am

mentarget wrote:Moody, you went too far by using what is writing in the Holy Bible as your points.


Would you like to elaborate what is holy about the verses I quoted from your bible?

By the way what does Christianity means "Begotten son"?
And what about other incorrect and proven wrong information.

Are they all PROOF of present Bible Divinity?
And also the PROOF, that it is not fabricated?

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Postby Oriani » Sun Dec 02, 2007 12:37 pm

Moody wrote:
mentarget wrote:Moody, you went too far by using what is writing in the Holy Bible as your points.


Would you like to elaborate what is holy about the verses I quoted from your bible?

By the way what does Christianity means "Begotten son"?
And what about other incorrect and proven wrong information.

Are they all PROOF of present Bible Divinity?
And also the PROOF, that it is not fabricated?


:?

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Postby Oriani » Sun Dec 02, 2007 12:38 pm

I don't know why we can't talk about these topics without arguing too much...

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Postby Krisi » Sun Dec 02, 2007 10:43 pm

I think this discussion is too much now. Matters not related to the actual topic is being raised to a point. There is no more respect in each ones belief. :( (It's as if there's one here who's perfect. Which is so unrealistic already...)
A lot has been said about the practices and rules of Islam religion and it is now leading to confussion. Even the real experts are keeping themselves quiet by not linking up unrelated topics on certain matters to avoid misunderstandings and confussion, I supposed. Why can't you?
I think showing off too much is not good (as in comparing one from the other). Keep a little for the rest to judge because the flaws will be very obvious later on if you go further into it. Otherwise, imperfections will eventually come out by itself. (Someone's actually spilling out the beans here. :P )
I could almost peek (from this discussion) that the rigidity of such religion shows that the women are almost treated like animals and not as humane beings. Have pity!
(Gosh! and even this news about that lady is being used to hitch up new faucet for discussion about the religion... let it rest!)

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Postby MissLT » Mon Dec 03, 2007 8:06 pm

You're hitting the nail on the head there, krisi. Well said.

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Postby Krisi » Mon Dec 03, 2007 10:10 pm

LennyeTran wrote:You're hitting the nail on the head there, krisi. Well said.


Thanks Lenne, I'm grateful you got what I mean.
Honestly, I don't know much about Islam but because of this, I have learned and have seen (:shock:) a lot! (good and evil) :shock: .... I don't want to know more than these! Horrible!
Talks about that woman should rest really. I noticed she's being used to the maximum. Is this how women are being treated there? Is this what they call respect? Even this news, the fact that she's a woman is being hauled to nowhere (by her "co-believer" in religion.). Where's the respect here? (Whether she's deserving of such respect or not she should be respected because she's humane! or is it really only for men?)
Now, this is a part of what I've seen from this discussion if they'll add more for sure I'll see more...:twisted:

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Postby jrkp » Tue Dec 04, 2007 1:43 am

=Ahmad= wrote:Dear JRKP,

Firstly, there are several types of punishment in this world such as (life) imprisonment, fine, house arrest, grounded, exile, and even death sentence. Whipping is just one of them.
........


Dear Ahmad, You can't compare the kind of punishments you mentioned... None of them imply suffering, and that's the whole point here... it's not the same to be at home without going anywhere than be whipped 200 times...

=Ahmad= wrote:......

Secondly, as far as I know (correct me If I am wrong) every law is strict. It’s the practice which is flexible. Similarly, Islamic law (system) is strict, but the practice is very flexible/ situational. For example, Islam forbids Muslims to consume pork. But if that’s the ONLY food available (I am sure that this situation is almost impossible to happen), then it’s allowed to consume it.


Well Ahmad, to me, not every law is strict. Every law is supposed to be FAIR... Believe it or not, there is a subtle difference... For example, if someone kills in self-defense, I think he shouldn't get the same sentence than someone who kill in cold blood.

=Ahmad= wrote:.....

Secondly, as far as I know (correct me If I am wrong) every law is strict. It’s the practice which is flexible. Similarly, Islamic law (system) is strict, but the practice is very flexible/ situational. For example, Islam forbids Muslims to consume pork. But if that’s the ONLY food available (I am sure that this situation is almost impossible to happen), then it’s allowed to consume it.


I couldn't say it better!!! Let's see.. Here's a women who was raped by 7 men. Then she was sentence to spend 90 says in prison and be whipped 200 times for break a law.

I wonder.. Where is the flexibility here? I mean, It isn't punishment enough be raped?. That's the whole discussion about, the lack of flexibilty of the judiciary system in middle east countries.

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The sharia'a law is not satanic.

Postby =Ahmad= » Tue Dec 04, 2007 4:44 am

Dear JRKP.

Firstly, I completely agree that killing for self-defense is different from killing people in cold-blooded ways.

Secondly, there are hundreds of punishments run every single day in Muslim countries from fine to imprisonment to death sentences. But this is rarely publicized since these kinds of punishments are also implemented in secular countries.

When whippings and cutting off hands (which are rarely done compared to other kinds of punishments) are implemented then some media expose them as if they are the only punishments in Islam. To be honest, I am learning these kinds of punishments, especially the psychological and social impacts. Next time, after I can grasp the concept, the implementation and positive sides well, I’ll share it with you.

Thirdly, I am not intending to show off Islam. I am just trying to clarify misunderstandings about Islam. The criminal law is only a small part in Sharia’a law. There are other concepts which are good to be implemented even in secular countries.

One of them is the sharia’a law on banking system. There have been a lot of scholars (not only Muslims) researching this concept. Some of them give positive appreciation on this concept.

The result is the establishment of Islamic banks in some secular countries. The UK is one of them. An Islamic bank (The Islamic Bank of Britain) has been set up in the UK.

The establishment of Islamic banks in secular countries is not only intending to accommodate Muslims’ aspirations but also because this kind of bank is considered a good alternative.

The customers of Islamic banks are not only Muslims but also non-Muslims. Why are there a lot of non-Muslim customers in Islamic banks?

First, the board of management is reliable because they have been recognized as honest people in its society. Besides, they are also professionals who know what they are doing.

Second, Islamic banks are considered safer and more impartial. The chances of fraud and money laundry to happen are very very small. It’s not only because the management are honest people but also because the system never tolerates cheating and injustice.


Dear Mofo.
Hope this would be useful. The sharia’a law is not satanic.

Thank you very much.

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Postby Moody » Tue Dec 04, 2007 9:24 am

You can close your eyes or do not accept for what ever reasons you have..
BUT YOU CAN'T DENY THAT EVERY RATIONAL INTELLIGENT LOGICAL KNOWLEDGE & SICENCE IS TESTIFYING FOR QURAN....AFTER EVERY NEXT DISCOVERY AND AWARENESS!

MODREN SCIENCE AND QURAN (ISLAMIC DIVINE BOOK)

Quran is not a book of science BUT a book of signs. It has more than 6000 verses out of which more than 1000 verses giving CLEAR signs about the modern scientific proven facts in recent couple of hundred years. (WHICH BY ANY POSSIBLE MEANS CANNOT BE SAID BY US HUMANS 1400 YEARS BACK. THE ONLY LOGIC IS THAT ITS FROM SOMEONE WHO IS COMMUNICATING TO A HUMAN AND KNOWS BETTER THAN HUMANS)

- For some people ONE sign is enough to believe.
- For some people 10 signs are enough.
- But some people don't come to believe even after more than 1000 miraculous signs.


Verses about:

1- Big bang theory (in a nut shell).
2- Geo spherical Ostrich egg shaped earth (spherical which is the exact shape)
3- Cosmic dust (referred more perfectly as smoke).
4- How water seep into the earth and rain cycle through AIR.
5- Sweet and salt water of oceans and barrier between them.
6-Expanding sun, solar system and universe for given period of time
7- Earth, sun and stars revolving on their axis and path (orbits).
8- Sun and moon have different paths (orbits).
9- Sun and stars consuming there energy.
10- Reflected sun light of moon. In Arabic mooneer (moon) it self means reflected light.
11- Upper thin layer of earth, which is hold by mountains as nails (bigger in size deep in earth) from shacking.
12- Perfect shape and stages of human embryo.
13- All living being made out of water.
14- All plants and even fruits have male and female atributes.
15- The exact way of plants and animals behaviour and how they communicate.

AND MANY MORE............

THESE ARE ALL RECENT DISCOVERIES AND SIGN FOR THOSE SINCERELY SEEKING TRUTH!!!!!! AND REMEMBER THAT IS NOT WHAT QURAN IS ALL ABOUT... THESE ARE JUST TESTIFYING SIGNS WITHOUT ANY FLAW OR FAULT.

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Postby zaman » Tue Dec 04, 2007 1:14 pm

I am a Muslim and I like the Islamic religious, but he should know that my brother Ahmed any person who has not judged by God and His Messenger for prayer and the peace outside the denominations. This way they distorted Islam reduction in ornamental clear, but did not hear the name of Islam by a legitimate privacy of others. I attacked and loved, but in a religious ruling that happened to these girls as the existing front of the novel is unfair and unjust

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Postby Moody » Wed Dec 05, 2007 10:09 am

BRINGING PROOF FROM YOUR OWN BIBLE BECAUSE YOU BELIEVE IN IT SO YOU NEED IT TO VARIFY, AS MUSLIMS PROOF AND WHAT WE BELIEVE IS QURAN.

Lies or Truth: Evidence speaks for it self !

1- There is not a single verse in ANY VERSION of Bible where Jesus (A.S) said, worship me OR I'm god. Instead he said,” I speak what I hear from father”, “My Father is greater than me."

2- Again word "Trinity" is not mentioned in ANY VERSION of the Bible. The closest verse to trinity that,” Father, Holy Ghost & spirit is one" is thrown out in your REVISED VERSION of Bible. As all your high priests said,” It was a concoction, fabrication, addition, a lie in the Bible, as no such verse is found in the most ancient scriptures".
So please ask your own priests who is lying and fabricating??????

3-We Muslims FOLLOW more in Jesus (A.S) commandments then you Christians:

(You say, you love Jesus (A.S.), but you disobey his every commandment).

4-From Adam to Jesus (PBUT) MENTIONED IN YOUR BIBLE, all prophets when prayed to God, they prostrated like we Muslims.
Do you follow Jesus, how to pray?

5- In ALL Bibles more than 3 times Jesus said swine-pig is forbidden to eat. We Muslims follow him, but you Christians follow PAUL and disobey Jesus (A.S.) commandments.

6- More than 4 occasions in ALL Bibles Jesus (A.S) told wine has bad attributes on the humans. But Paul quotes the "FIRST MIRACLE OF JESUS" and since then wine is flowing like water in Christendom and NOT AT ALL in Muslimdom. (Bible said water tasted like wine and never said turned into wine).

7- Jesus said," I came to keep all the commandments of the God and not to break them". But you Christians broke EACH AND EVERY of them.
Hale-aluu-Yaa to Church, Paul, Mathew, John and Luke!!!!!

8-According to Christian Bible first miracle of Jesus (A.S.) was turning water taste like wine and recovering the shortage in the gathering. But according to Quran the first miracle of Jesus was talking to Jews when he was infant in his mother’s arms.

When after birth, Mary came:
According to the BIBLE she told the Jews that she hear voices and then had a child birth. Do you believe your daughter or sister, if she come and tell you she had birth after hearing voices? Do you think when “IF” Mary had told that to the Jews, they would have believed her???
But Quran tells that the Jews accused her, she knows that Jesus (A.S) was the miraculous birth. So she told the Jews ask the infant. And miraculously Jesus (A.S) talked to them and told them that I'm the messenger from God, so be nice and respectful to my mother as she is among the highest of the pious. Quran gives highest respect to Mary, even there is a complete chapter by her name in Quran. You have chapters named by Mathew, Luke, John or lying Paul and many others but not a single by his mothers name Mary.
Which version would you like to tell to your children, HEARING VOICES AND GETTING PRAGNANT or MIRACULOUS TALK????


9-Christians says Jesus (A.S) was the BEGOTTEN SON. What are you trying to apply here? So what you are trying to put in all the humans throat is that the All Mighty God Who made every thing miraculously from Adam to every thing of this world needs to come done to seed…. (God forgive us for such satanic thinking). Allah tells in Quran that when He wants to do some thing, He just says and it happens. He begets not nor He begotten and no one is like Him. Human miracles are not the proof of any kind of divinity. Jesus (A.S) was the prophet like all other prophets with miracles.

10-Christians says Jesus (A.S) get crucified for there sins. And a son of god (not mentioned any where in the Bible, he himself never said that). And dozens of Bible verses proving that he was not died through crucifixion. You Christians are also divided about it.
So basically what you are making to swallow us (the whole human race) is that the whole nation rape, kill and do bad atrocities and when brought for justice, there King hang his own son instead of punishing them. IT DOES REALLY MAKE PERFECT SENSE! Hale- alu- Yaa PAUL and the greatest deceiving of the human history.

11- Jesus says “ He is jealous God only pray to Him”. But Christians are eager to make partner to Him. We Muslims only pray to God and don’t make any partners to Him.

So I am asking you a question:

Next time does Jesus (A.S) come to the house of people who are obeying his commandments OR who are TOTALLY disobeying his commandments???

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Postby Mofo » Wed Dec 05, 2007 5:39 pm

I wonder what kind a whip they use. Do you know that people can die from less wipping?

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Postby Tora » Wed Dec 05, 2007 5:56 pm

Mofo wrote:I wonder what kind a whip they use. Do you know that people can die from less wipping?


Never have been interested... Any corporal punishment is outrageous, we are not in medieval times any more

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Postby Vega » Thu Dec 06, 2007 11:02 am

Mofo wrote:I wonder what kind a whip they use. Do you know that people can die from less wipping?


What if they use a chain whip maid of a steel? BTW, why can one die from less whipping? :roll: :?

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Whippings are not done in sadistic ways.

Postby =Ahmad= » Thu Dec 06, 2007 11:34 am

Tora wrote:
Mofo wrote:I wonder what kind a whip they use. Do you know that people can die from less wipping?


Never have been interested... Any corporal punishment is outrageous, we are not in medieval times any more



Whippings are not done in sadistic ways.

Whippings are usually conducted after the Friday prayers at a masjid front yard. Before the punishment is done, the wrong doer is treated very well. After the Friday prayers, the wrong doer is taken to the masjid front yard, and without a lot of ceremonies, the punishment is then conducted as quickly as possible.

After the punishment is conducted, then the person is taken to the hospital and treated well by a medical team.

The punishment is done as well as possible. It’s only the executor’s right hand swinging, NOT his left hand or other body parts. So, one lash after another over the wrong doer is not as strong as a ball from the pitcher in a basketball game which gets additional power from the swinging of left hand, legs and other body parts.

The whip is made of a rattan stick so that the whippings won’t get the acceleration power due to flexible movements. In other words, the power of the executioners is not full.

Don’t imagine that the whipping is just like presented by The Passion of the Christ movie. The Roman people went too far. They did the whipping as hard as they can with flexible tools as well as sharp edged tools. That was really sadistic and unacceptable.

USUALLY, in the evening, a news reader reads the news about the whipping. The announcement is done wisely. The news reader reads the news in a soft intonation without any commercial breaks. In other words, the wrong doer is punished but s/he is not treated as the garbage of society.

And the most important thing is that before the punishment conducted, the health condition of the wrong doer is examined first to make sure whether or not s/he is ready for the punishment.

Thank you very much.

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Postby Hardi » Thu Dec 06, 2007 1:47 pm

So wiping to them is often more as humiliation or shame than physical violence..? It's seems good law for non Muslim foreigners. When violating law and they allow you to chose get wiped or going to jail. Seems that get wiped is better...

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Postby Mofo » Thu Dec 06, 2007 5:29 pm

Ah! I see. It is a retan cane like in Singapore. I have been beat with these sticks......they do not hurt so bad.


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